I'm currently in my 4th round of P2, but in anticipation of a stable P3 I've been doing some research and math. I want to see what you guys think about this (stay with me, it's nerdy Type A stuff):

They say a pound of fat equals 3500 calories, right? OK, so I wanted to see how many calories per day I burned in my P2 phases. I took the average loss per day (divide total lbs lost by # of days on diet, including load days), then multiplied that by 3500 to get the average daily calories burned, i.e. FAT BURNED. Then, I added 500 calories from the foods I ate during P2. It looked like this:
R1P2 average (0.52 lbs/day) x 3500 cals = 1810 calories from body fat + 500 calories from food = 2310 calories per day
R3P2 average (0.69 lbs/day) x 3500 cals = 2380 calories from body fat + 500 calories from food = 2880 calories per day (note the increase!)

(I didn't count Round 2 because I tried a "lo carb" off-protocol version touted by my HCG clinic - didn't work for me...wicked cravings and poor stabilizing)

So what I gather is that between Round 1 and Round 3, my metabolism had risen by 570 calories per day! Cool, huh? But the really interesting thing to me is this idea: If my body was burning 2880 calories per day during P2, would it keep burning that many on P3 and P4? I have never counted calories in P3 but have only stabilized well for awhile, then my weight tended to creep back up (probably when I starting introducing riskier foods). I know Grammy and many other veterans don't count calories in P3, but I can't completely ignore the whole calories in/calories out idea because at some point I started to gain weight again after each round. Maybe the veterans are just "accidentally" staying within their calorie limits without having to count (since their metabolisms are reset so high - how cool is that?)

This time, what I'm going to try when I get to P3 (just 20 short days away!) is: Figure out my average daily calories burned during P2, then during P3, count my calories, staying near that P2 value (with NO STARCH or SUGAR) and see if there is a point where my metabolism starts to slow back down (indicated by a weight gain). Then I'm going to decrease my calories little by little until I find my true stabilization point (hopefully a teen-age boy's metabolism!) I don't want to count calories forever, but since I've had a hard time keeping the weight off after 3 rounds, this is my plan for success this time... the LAST TIME! As much as I love this Protocol, I don't ever want to do it again.

By the way I'm blood type O (Grammy knows a lot about blood type diet sensitivities...?) I have yet to look into this but it could also be a factor in why some of us have a harder time stabilizing, depending on what we eat.

I would love to hear what any of you fellow nerds out there think! ;o)

Excellent thoughts.

The low carb round 2...did you cut out the breadstick/melba and find that not only didnt help, but hurt?

Good plan...find your bodies comfort zone.

Blood type diet has good info...also worth checking out...Body Ecology Diet. Same idea but differs on some points of the blood type diet.

Have you ever had an Alcat run to see if you have any sensitivities to foods? Could your P4 issues have come from something that caused inflammation?

Only in my first round of hcg, but have a done a lot of reading on how I could be fat and eat so healthy?? lol
Thanks for the formula...please let me know how it works out.

my thoughts are that your metabolism is not set "high", but rather normalized. so if it's really screwed up from previous diet attempts, etc., it should go back to normal- but you can't reset it high by eating a lot of calories in P3.

another is that you don't know how much fat you lost per round, vs. muscle- and since muscle weighs more (per area of volume) than fat does, that can account for part of the change.

also, many people lose more on R1 because they're losing a lot of water weight initially. if you applied this math to them, it would look like their metabolism went down, rather than up. but the idea of sticking to that many calories in P3 is an interesting idea. :)

i'd be curious to see what kind of number you come up with this formula: http://hcgdietinfo.com/hcgvanillaforum/discussion/2849/1/phase-3-what-is-my-bmr-and-how-do-i-figure-it-out/

mgsondance-According to the BMI calculator I should be at just over 2000 calories per day. And, therein lies the big question I've always had about being overweight. Prior to hcg I was eating about 1400 calories per day (at a higher weight) and not losing. I kept a food diary for 3 months and was being honest about what I was eating. Drs. always implied that I must be lying because there was no way I was eating 1400 calories and weighed over 240 pounds.
In P3 and P4 I was eating about 1600 calories and stabilized about 3 pounds over LIW. I didn't add in a lot of carbs or sugar (I tried some here and there without much problem).
I can't imagine being able to eat 2000 calories per day without gaining. I would love that, but it just doesn't seem to work with me.

I don't have an answer for this....but, it has always frustrated me that I ate a good diet (though not perfect) and was the largest one in the room.

Also, Quelsen, I do better on red meat too. I'm type 'O'.