I agree colleen, more power to you! This just reminds me of a natural patenting forum I used to be on moderated by THE perfect mom. After she had a breakdown and abandoned her three kids and husband, leaving the forum, the rest of us started divulging all our imperfections we were too scared to admit publicly.

as always, i do think it's best to do a "pure" round first to see how your body reacts- otherwise you will have nothing to compare to. but yet your body is in a different state for each round, so there is still no way to have a "control" group, even with yourself! many people lose more the first round because they are losing a lot of water weight when they first eat low-carb. and you are at a different starting weight for subsequent rounds, your hypothalamus is supposed to be already "reset", etc. so even if we did things exactly the same, our stats might not be the same.

that said, i think there should be a reasonable theory behind making changes- like the idea that broccoli and cauliflower are similar to cabbage. as beestly points out, many people including colleen now recommend that you not eat the breadsticks- but what is there is a good reason for us having a small amount of starch in our diets while on P2? should we substitute it with another type of grain?? So.... i do believe if Dr. S. were alive today, that his protocol would be different- the question is probably not whether it would have changed, but HOW it would have changed.

and here's a bit of trivia to chew on- everything we know about medicine DOUBLES, every 2 years. doubles! so if you get your calculator out, that means if they knew 10 facts about the human body in 1959, they knew 10,240 by 1969. and 10,485,760 by 1979! You get the idea (my calculator won't go high enough!)

we probably are not going to see clinical research done on the best approach, because there is no money in it. so although our experimenting is far from ideal, it's also all we have.

but newbies- please do a "clean" round first.

As it was said before, we are all adults here. There is no harm in trying something new if the original is not working for you. I hate to cook, so I used protein powder my second round. We all live and learn. But in order to help the newbies out, maybe we could only post "Off Protocol" ideas on this thread, or maybe start off any comment with the title OFF PROTOCOL if that is the case. Just an idea...

Jen

I know, Beth! I've been there, done that. On my first round I thought oh that sugar free creamer is only 20 calories. that can't hurt. On my 2nd round I though well he doesn't say how much fat we can have in our milk so half and half can't hurt. LOL I finally realized I was just making excuses and my third round losses were better because I followed the protocol. So that's why I want our new chicks to know. Yes you can cheat if you want. we all can. But I just want them to know and think, okay is changing the protocol worth me losing 20 pounds when I might have lost 30? If they decide yes it is worth it, then great! As long as they know.
Colleen

Not to mention the time and $$ involved. And not just the $$ for the hcg; all the "special" groceries we've acquired (Stevia, Stevia packets, flavored Stevia as examples). Although I understand WHY someone wants to go rogue (believe me, I am already tired of ACV as a salad dressing), I'm just not willing to risk it. This protocol is SO successful, and, quite frankly, FAST! I don't want to "slow down" and take even LONGER just so I can have the "rogue" items. I understand "tweaking" because of health or obligatory issues (I had an event I HAD to attend my last round and KNEW I would NOT be able to eat protocol AT ALL), but those "situations" are different than just saying "gee, I think I'll try this today..". A great example is Coconut oil. I use it NORMALLY when I am not on this protocol, but I am not willing to even gain *this much* just to take the risk to see if it effects me or not. Again, it may NOT show up on the scale now, but, who knows, it may make the difference between stabilizing well or not, and I really, REALLY want to make this weight loss PERMENANT; NOT always having to do a "round". I also look at the psychology behind "being rogue", and I wonder if wanting/needing/changing certain aspects of the protocol submarine our journey later on. Seriously, it's only 23/40 days. We didn't get this way by accident and granted, some of us had health issues that didn't help our cause either, but, we are ALL here now because...we need to lose weight! "Tweaking" got us where we were before ("I'll just have one ________" which turned into 1000 ), so even though I understand WHY folks think they need to change (grilled chicken breast is the most boring meal ever), the problem is, we need to learn to play by the rules a little better as well. Am I advocating someone falling over in faint because their bloodsugar is off or because they develop an allergy or sensitivity? NO!!! But we ALL basically "know" what we are supposed to do and why. I fear that what Mgsondance says is true for most; that the weight WILL all come back because they really didn't reset their hypothalmuses due to all the "tinkering". I also believe that this diet IS 60 years old and Dr. S PROBABLY would have changed things, added things, deleted things, etc., but because he is no longer with us, and there really is no one else besides the Doc in Argentina, then we just need to "cowboy up" and stick with what he says. I'd also like to point out, and I am NOT scolding anyone, but I think many here need to go back and reread what they say..."It didn't effect me at all, but I was in a stall for "x" days...". I mean, seriously ladies! On one thread you're posting you went rogue and on another you post you gained/stalled/didn't stabilize. Telling the TRUTH to YOURSELF is a most important facet of this whole journey. Quit making excuses! LOVE YOURSELVES! You've gotten this far....CTM!!!!!!!!!

;)