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Thread: Hypothyroidism & Hasimotos

  1. #349
    Senior Member DuhPrincess's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kangaroo View Post
    Oh, wanted to add that my pain has gone way down since I upped my dosage of T3/T4 med. Now the pain changes position over the day, quite strange. It's still bad enough that at night I need to take medication and sometimes during the day. The neck exercises also seem to help.
    I've post this article before, but will repost it as finding and reading it was a turning point for me in understanding my Adrenals and that I truly had an adrenal issue. It was like reading my life story of physical difficulties that I had no idea were connected to adrenal insufficiency.

    http://www.tuberose.com/Adrenal_Glands.html

    Here's an excerpt:

    "People with adrenal fatigue often look and act relatively normal. They may not have any obvious signs of physical illness, yet they are not well and live with a general sense of dis-ease or “gray” feelings. They often use coffee, colas, sugar, and other stimulants to get going in the morning and to prop themselves up during the day. These people may appear to be lazy and unmotivated, or to have lost their ambition, when in reality quite the opposite is true; they are forced to drive themselves much harder than people with healthy adrenal function merely to accomplish life’s everyday tasks."

  2. #350
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    Quote Originally Posted by DuhPrincess View Post
    I've post this article before, but will repost it as finding and reading it was a turning point for me in understanding my Adrenals and that I truly had an adrenal issue. It was like reading my life story of physical difficulties that I had no idea were connected to adrenal insufficiency.

    http://www.tuberose.com/Adrenal_Glands.html

    Here's an excerpt:

    "People with adrenal fatigue often look and act relatively normal. They may not have any obvious signs of physical illness, yet they are not well and live with a general sense of dis-ease or “gray” feelings. They often use coffee, colas, sugar, and other stimulants to get going in the morning and to prop themselves up during the day. These people may appear to be lazy and unmotivated, or to have lost their ambition, when in reality quite the opposite is true; they are forced to drive themselves much harder than people with healthy adrenal function merely to accomplish life’s everyday tasks."
    that's me

  3. #351
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    Receptionist of my endo called today. She has called in a new prescription for me, but I haven't seen it yet. Since my levels were so off, there is no surprise there, but I can't see her again until Aug 31--frustrating. So, I've ordered Thiroyd from Thailand. I'm not comfortable self-medicating, but I feel desperate and probably will.
    Judging from what I've read about adrenals, it seems pretty obvious I'm having a problem there too, but I'm not comfortable self-medicating for adrenals either, especially since I have not been tested and cannot until I visit the States in January. So I think I'll hold off on treating adrenals.
    So prognosis seems a bit unclear for now. I do know a US specialist (for female hormone issues) I might be able to have a phone consult with, but I don't know her opinion on natural thyroid and adrenal testing. My neck/shoulder/arm pain is much better since I upped my T3/T4 dosage, but I'm still stiff and fatigued. Taking the kids to see Kung Fu Panda 2 today. Have a great day, y'all.

  4. #352
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    My new prescription is Cynomel (T3) plus L-Thyroxine Serb (liquid T4) plus minerals (calcium, chromium, magnesium) and a bunch of homeopathic stuff. I guess I'll start it, but I don't feel that great about it. I'm already on a T3/T4 medicine, and obviously my body doesn't like it. Since I've upped the dose, I feel a bit better, but still feel like crap and have arm pains. Today my pain feel like flu aches and pains. I don't know if I believe that homeoplathic treatment can help in an advanced case like this. I'm waiting for my Thiroyd to arrive. If my new treatment doesn't make me feel better, I think I'll try the Thiroyd when it comes. I sure wish I was working with a doctor......

  5. #353
    Senior Member DuhPrincess's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kangaroo View Post
    My new prescription is Cynomel (T3) plus L-Thyroxine Serb (liquid T4) plus minerals (calcium, chromium, magnesium) and a bunch of homeopathic stuff. I guess I'll start it, but I don't feel that great about it. I'm already on a T3/T4 medicine, and obviously my body doesn't like it. Since I've upped the dose, I feel a bit better, but still feel like crap and have arm pains. Today my pain feel like flu aches and pains. I don't know if I believe that homeoplathic treatment can help in an advanced case like this. I'm waiting for my Thiroyd to arrive. If my new treatment doesn't make me feel better, I think I'll try the Thiroyd when it comes. I sure wish I was working with a doctor......
    Back in the old days, doctors would assess a patients symptoms. If they had the obvious symptoms of thyroid or adrenal issues, the doctor would prescribe a trial of a medicine. Then, if the patient felt better, they would tell them to keep taking it or adjust the dosage until the patient felt good. If they didn't feel good on that med, they would try something else or a different dose. When you self-treat, you're doing it the old fashioned way. But today doctors force you to purchase an expensive (& patented) TSH test before they will address your symptoms. And if the test says you're just fine, then the doctor ignorantly parrots that info and will refuse to treat your obvious (and potentionally dangerous) symptoms. I read that there are a lot more people who suffer dire consequences from NOT taking enough (or any) thyroid meds than those who have problems because they may be taking too much. The symptoms of over-medicating are fairly obvious. The symptom of "racing, rolling over heart beat" can be caused by either too much or too little medication.

    And according to STTM (Stop The Thyroid Madness) once you start taking natural thyroid meds, your body will adjust in about 2 weeks. This means you will start to feel as bad or worse than you did before you started using the meds. This is a sign that you need to up your dose somewhat at this point. What is sad is you can't find a doctor who truly understands the thyroid or your particular issues. And doctors who do understand these complex issues are hard to find. Be smart in the meantime until you do find a good doctor. Pay attention to your symptoms and adjust your meds up or down carefully as indicated by your symptoms. It is rare to do serious long term damage by taking a little too much thyroid medication for a short time according to what I've read by researchers on thryoidscience.us. Keep educating yourself as this is very important.

    Edited to Ask: Can you separate your T3 & T4? Or are they all together in one pill or capsule? If you can take one or the other, just take the T3 and slowly decrease the liquid T4 for awhile and see if you perk up. That's what I would do if I could.

  6. #354
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    My T3 and T4 are separate. The T3 is pills, and I'm supposed to take 1/2 (it's a 0.025 mg pill). the T4 is liquid, and I'm supposed to take 20 drops, which corresponds to .100 mg. Meanwhile the Thiroyd should arrive any day now. I think I'll try her prescription and see how it goes. If still not well before I leave on vacation in one week, I'll probably change it. I'm not sure why she replaced my T3/T4 pill with the same in another form. Maybe to tweak the proportions. Or maybe the liquid T4 is different. Have you heard of liquid T4? L-Thyroxine Serb (Serb is the brand name).

  7. #355
    Senior Member DuhPrincess's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kangaroo View Post
    My T3 and T4 are separate. The T3 is pills, and I'm supposed to take 1/2 (it's a 0.025 mg pill). the T4 is liquid, and I'm supposed to take 20 drops, which corresponds to .100 mg. Meanwhile the Thiroyd should arrive any day now. I think I'll try her prescription and see how it goes. If still not well before I leave on vacation in one week, I'll probably change it. I'm not sure why she replaced my T3/T4 pill with the same in another form. Maybe to tweak the proportions. Or maybe the liquid T4 is different. Have you heard of liquid T4? L-Thyroxine Serb (Serb is the brand name).
    I haven't heard of a liquid form of T4 except for one that a compounding pharmacy probably used for my friend's script. They combine T3 & T4 into a capsule suspended in Olive Oil for her. That was done to replace the Armour that was too hard to find (plus the changes in formula that affected its potency). Your body has to convert that T4 to T3 in your liver in order to use it. You won't be at risk if you skip the T4 and slowly increase your T3 only. Doctors are concerned that your thyroid will get "lazy" and that's why they avoid T3. But the problem is that if your body can't convert T4 to use it as T3, then you are basically going untreated and depriving you of the active form of the hormone isn't going to prevent your thyroid from getting "lazy." And not treating your thyroid IS dangerous. Or if your body is making Reverse T3's, then the T4 aggravates the problem. T3 is basically safe to use if you are careful about it. When you start to feel normal, stop increasing your dose and stay there awhile. Be ready to lower it if after awhile you have strange symptoms such as itchy skin or if your heart starts racing and "rolling over" in your chest. Don't stop using the meds--just reduce them until the bad symptoms stop.

  8. #356
    Senior Member maile's Avatar
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    Good suggestions from DP, .025 of T3 is miniscule, a healthy body normally produces 18-27 mg of T3 per day so if you are not able to convert the T4 to T3 (and for many the conversion is compromised) then the amount of T3 you are getting is crazy low.

  9. #357
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    Hi guys! Kangaroo, I'm glad to see you're getting help here on the thread, as well as through your doctor it seems. I hope you get your meds figured out soon. There is so much to try to figure out!

    DuhPrincess, I am finding your posts very, very helpful and insightful. You know a lot about this stuff. I'm trying to learn as much as I can. I'd like to know your opinion on my situation if you don't mind. I originally posted on here a few pages back my story about being recently diagnosed. I wasn't symptomatic of thyroid problems as far as I knew at the time. I was diagnosed through bloodwork. I originally decided not to take any meds because I thought I felt fine and felt it wasn't necessary. Well, a couple weeks later I started losing a lot of hair and was feeling more tired. I was hoping the hair loss was a result of finishing my second round of HCG. But after a couple weeks of hair loss, I decided to start taking my meds. So I've been on 60 mg of Armour for 2 weeks now. I might be feeling a little less tired now but the hair loss continues everyday. It's worrying me big time. So I guess my biggest question is, do you have any idea how long I can expect the hair loss to continue? It's been at least a month now and if it keeps up at this rate, it will definitely become noticeable soon. I also see that people should increase their dose after a couple weeks of being on their meds. Here's my problem with that - the prescription I have is only a 30 day supply with no refills. This doctor doesn't plan to prescribe me anything until I come back and get more bloodwork done after being on the meds for awhile. If I start taking more of what I have in order to increase my dose, I'll just end up running out sooner and could be without meds entirely at some point. Thanks in advance for your help! Anyone else, feel free to chime in with your thoughts as well. I appreciate it!
    Round 1 start date: 1/22/11 - Lost 19 pounds
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    Long break after round 2. Gained back 7 pounds because I was a big pig over the summer.

    Round 3 start date: 9/24/11 - Lost 14 pounds total - 7 new pounds, 7 old pounds :-)


  10. #358
    Senior Member DuhPrincess's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ailuj View Post
    Hi guys! Kangaroo, I'm glad to see you're getting help here on the thread, as well as through your doctor it seems. I hope you get your meds figured out soon. There is so much to try to figure out!

    DuhPrincess, I am finding your posts very, very helpful and insightful. You know a lot about this stuff. I'm trying to learn as much as I can. I'd like to know your opinion on my situation if you don't mind. I originally posted on here a few pages back my story about being recently diagnosed. I wasn't symptomatic of thyroid problems as far as I knew at the time. I was diagnosed through bloodwork. I originally decided not to take any meds because I thought I felt fine and felt it wasn't necessary. Well, a couple weeks later I started losing a lot of hair and was feeling more tired. I was hoping the hair loss was a result of finishing my second round of HCG. But after a couple weeks of hair loss, I decided to start taking my meds. So I've been on 60 mg of Armour for 2 weeks now. I might be feeling a little less tired now but the hair loss continues everyday. It's worrying me big time. So I guess my biggest question is, do you have any idea how long I can expect the hair loss to continue? It's been at least a month now and if it keeps up at this rate, it will definitely become noticeable soon. I also see that people should increase their dose after a couple weeks of being on their meds. Here's my problem with that - the prescription I have is only a 30 day supply with no refills. This doctor doesn't plan to prescribe me anything until I come back and get more bloodwork done after being on the meds for awhile. If I start taking more of what I have in order to increase my dose, I'll just end up running out sooner and could be without meds entirely at some point. Thanks in advance for your help! Anyone else, feel free to chime in with your thoughts as well. I appreciate it!
    I am stumped about your hair loss unless it is a side effect of the hcg. I have taken Biotin as a precaution occasionally while on hcg. The only time I've ever lost hair was during my last pregnancy 18 years ago so I could understand how hcg might cause hair loss. It did grow back in shortly after I had my daughter. I am stumped how you could feel just fine but have a doctor tell you about a thyroid test that indicates a problem. Usually people feel like crap and ask for a thyroid test and the doc says they're just fine--even when it really is a thyroid problem! Did the doc say what your "numbers" were on the TSH test? I wonder if they were unusually high--like 5.0 to 10.00. Did you have any other symptoms that brought you to the doctor in the first place? Or was it a routine checkup? Did you doctor say anything about Hashimotos?

    Someone else should jump in here. I fear I'm not being very helpful. So sorry! Will go back and find your other post...

  11. #359
    Senior Member DuhPrincess's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ailuj View Post
    Hi there! I just read through most of this thread and learned so much. I hope you don't mind me sharing my story and asking for some help!

    I was recently diagnosed as hypo. I was wasn't feeling well and couldn't get in to my regular doc, so I went to a walk-in clinic. The doctor there said I looked tired and did blood work to check my thyroid. My free T3 levels were low and he told me I had hypothyroidism. He prescribed me 60 mg thyroid (I think it's armour). Since I wasn't having symptoms, I decided to follow up with my regular doc to get her opinion. She prescribed me a very, very small dose of levothyroxine, .025 mg. I decided not to take either of the meds since I was having no symptoms at all. This was right at the end of my second round, about a month ago. Now I am having symptoms. TOM is 2 weeks late and about 2 weeks ago I started losing a lot of hair and still am. Not knowing a thing about thyroid meds or hypothyroidism, I decided to take the levothyroxine. I've been on it for about a week and I think my hair loss is getting even worse. I spoke with the walk-in doc today and he said it was fine to go ahead and switch to the armour he prescribed. I'm starting that tomorrow. Do you think it will help with hair loss? I am incredibly worried and upset about my hair loss. It is noticeably thinner to me now and I'm so worried it is going to be noticeable to others soon. Is there anything else I can take or anything I can do to help with this?

    Thanks in advance for your thoughts and advice. I'm so happy to have found this thread. I've learned so much already.
    Found your post. Levothyroxine is the same as Synthroid. Many people lose hair when taking it. The other problem could be the Armour you're taking. Armour changed its formula about a year or more ago. The cellulose filler they now use causes an absorption problem of the active ingredients. Unfortunately, Armour will NOT change it back to the original formula. This caused quite an uproar when the info came out about the change. Many people who had done well on Armour for years were suddenly back at their doctor's office complaining of hypo symptoms returning. Even the doctors did not know about this change and assumed these patients were nuts. It was never announced. So, if you are one of the many people who are taking Armour with poor results, that may be why.

    This Armour problem happened to my friend. Her doc could not even locate her dosage of Armour at any local pharmacies. So my friend gave her doctor information about Women's International Pharmacy. They compounded her a combination of T4 & T3 (suspended in Olive Oil Capsules) that was the equivalent to her previous Armour prescription. And now she's doing great again.

    And I see that others have mentioned taking Biotin also. I have not had hair loss on hcg and don't know if the biotin prevented it or not. I may just be one of those people who doesn't lose hair on this diet. I'm also taking about 50 mcg of T3 daily. I do not use any T4.

    If you have insurance coverage and a doctor that is willing to prescribe Armour, you could probably talk to him about your concerns and tell him what you've learned about Armour in your research. Here's one article that discusses this issue:

    http://thyroid.about.com/od/thyroidd...ormulation.htm

    Hope this helps. Wish I could do more. Again, anyone else feel free to jump in....

  12. #360
    Senior Member Primalmama's Avatar
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    You may do fine on the Armour, but if you don't - crush it or chew it, that's the advice from Stop The Thyroid Madness. Chewing it breaks up the cellulose filler that they use and frees the hormone for absorption.
    The reason you may not have done well on levothyroxine is that your T4 production may be fine, mine was too. Notice your first doc said your T3 was low. Some people have a form of hypothryoidism caused by a difficulty converting T4 (the inactive form of thyroid hormone and what is in levothyroxine) into T3 which is the sctive form.
    I had exactly the same issue and giving me more T4 in the form of levothyroxine would have been a waste of time as my T4 levels were excellent. My T3 however was in the toilet! I've been on Armour (which has T4 and T3 in a 4:1 ratio the same as our bodies) for 6 months now and feel wonderful. My hair has grown back, I have more energy and I finally feel like I have my life back.
    Don't be surprised if you need to titrate up to get to the correct dose too, I started at 1 1/2 grains per day and am now on 3, that seems to be the magic number for me.
    Good luck!!
    Emma

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    Round one - 28 days - 9.3kg lost. LDW 85.5kg
    Round two - 28 days - 3.4kg lost. LIW 83.5kg
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