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Thread: The Stabilization of MissM

  1. #121
    Super Member! Dubbles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leez View Post
    What evil genius thought of drizzling chocolate on plantain chips?

    *casts that thought into the outer darkness....*

    Truer words never spoken Leez! Ha!

  2. #122
    Quote Originally Posted by Dubbles View Post
    mrsstrong, there is no way that I could purchase the plantain chips with chocolate drizzled on top. Never ever. They would be consumed in one sitting. Didn't know they were even available!
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  3. #123
    Quote Originally Posted by Leez View Post
    What evil genius thought of drizzling chocolate on plantain chips?

    *casts that thought into the outer darkness....*
    You made me literally LOL
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  4. #124
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    My first thought.... that was a craving of a crazy insane pregnant woman haha
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  5. #125
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    Thanks for the smiles this morning, y'all! Indeed, there are some foods so tasty for deliciousness' sake I don't even want to taste them. Lord knows at this point in my life I simply don't need more things to crave. I keep having to say this to BF, LOL. When it comes to plantains, the ease of cracking open a bag of already-made delicious chips (whether drizzled in chocolate or no) is just too easy. I think for me a good mechanism is to allow myself plantains only if I'm doing the very real labor of peeling those suckers when green, smashing them, frying them twice, and only then sitting down to enjoy--and only very once in a while. I prefer patacones (described above) to chips anyway. And going back on what I just said, I will absolutely allow myself to have them from a restaurant with ceviche while in Costa Rica. I have two trips there planned for later this year if all goes well globally in diminishing this bloody pandemic. . . .

  6. #126
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    Thanks for your candor, mrsstrong. Definitely food for thought about long-term maintenance and who we want to be with and around food. It's simply going to be a lifelong process, I'm afraid. At least for me. I fully aware that my relationship and behavior with food is the source of major lessons for me in this life, and it helps me to see it in that kind of spiritual way.

    But what you said gives me pause, because of course, like you, I would like to think I'll be done with HCG after I fully stabilize at goal. However, it's entirely possible I'll need and want to return for a round from time to time. But what can I do now to help pre-correct that potential course is kind of what I'm thinking--while also remain compassionate toward myself if and when I do need to come back?

    I sincerely hope you're not beating yourself up about the change in direction of your intended course. Life certainly does happen. And all of us often make choices we know aren't in our best interest, ie giving in to the carb monster when we know keto-style works best. For me it's a matter of dieting fatigue, frankly, and so I'm thinking about how to address that ahead of time. Allowing for enough "treats" and freedom with food so I don't feel like I'm living with a dieting mentality and yet also having some mechanisms in place so those treats don't become a runaway train feels like a key. In other words, how to allow for true once-in-a-while treats without feeding that carb monster so fully that it's out of control?

    I think for me I know what foods are least healthy for me. Some of them I can pretty much stay away from indefinitely without much bother, like seed oils and processed, packaged foods I simply don't care for. However, the time will come when I will deliberately want to eat some of the things I know aren't as healthy for me. I'm thinking about dairy and sugar and wheat, for example. Yes, I will want to eat ice cream this summer, probably in a cone. But I will have one really amazingly worth-it cone from some small-batch, locally-made, artisanal ice cream shop, probably while on vacation--or at least a daycation drive to the lakeshore. I won't buy a gallon (or even a pint) from the grocery store and keep it in my freezer. That's a food without brakes for me, and having it around will definitely feed the sugar dragon, as I like to call it, and serve as a gateway to all kinds of bad choices, potentially for much longer than I would like.

    One less-than-healthy choice can lead to another and another and another and on and on. I've witnessed it in myself so many times. I would like to think I've learned that a less-than-healthy choice (and subsequent resulting tangential less-than-healthy choices) need to have an end point. I think that's why I was able to stabilize through the holidays last year following my first round of HCG. I loosened the reins just enough to feel like I fully indulged in all the ways I really wanted to (and believe me: I did INDULGE); however, I had a date to start my second round, so when I still had leftover New Year's black-eyed peas at that point, I stuck them in the freezer and then gave them to BF. He just ate them two weeks ago and loved every bite.

    Anyway, I'm still in P3 and have a little more than another week to go, and I'm already beginning to experiment a bit. My P3 is dairy-free as well as starch- and sugar-free; however, as I mentioned yesterday, I did off road the tiniest bit on Sunday during date night with BF: a sip of beer, dipping a homemade potato chip in blue cheese dressing. And it was fine. It also happened amid a meal of steak with broccoli and green beans. So I also think context matters. If I balance a little "treat" with plenty of protein and non-starchy vegetable, that tends to help stave off the sugar dragon. I'm quite certain it's part being well nourished and having a solid base as well as other more scientific and complex navigation and balancing of hormonal response through food. Though I did notice that on the drive home, I was snacky. It was late and I wasn't physiologically hungry, but I had a desire to nosh on something as I drove. But I made a rule for myself years ago that I don't eat in the car, so it was a NO CHOICE moment. By the time I got home, I had made it through the craving and was perfectly fine. But I can't help but wonder if that was one of those moments--when a less-than-healthy choice potentially opens the floodgates to more less-than-healthy choices. But I headed it off with a mechanism in place to halt that next less-than-healthy choice.

    This is where I think the cognitive behavioral therapy techniques I've learned in Beck Diet Solution come in extremely handy. At some point there needs to be an intellectual override to the body's desires and cravings, and having some very practical tools really helps.

    i've gone on long enough about this, but again, thank you for raising this. It's certainly a major part of my process to consider and reflect on how I want to live long term--and in a way that allows me to maintain and stabilize for as long and effortlessly as possible, becoming aware of weight gains and negative patterns and less-than-healthy choices sooner rather than later so I can correct and change course before the need is so great as to require another round of HCG. Though if it happens, it happens. It's all learning, I like to say. . . .

  7. #127
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    Happy Paddy's Day!

    Well that response to mrsstrong went on far longer than I intended!

    The update here is I'm doing just fine. Making my way and feeling fine. My Irish breakfast was delightful, and I enjoyed every mouthful. And that's it now for a bit. I put the rest of the uncooked fixings in the freezing for another time. Today is corned beef and cabbage, and I'm going to try it out in the Instant Pot. Haven't decided yet if I'll do some rutabaga and turnips in lieu of potatoes or not. That colcannon I made with cauliflower and kale may be plenty, and I can save those other relatively low-carb root veggies for another day. Thinking I might make an almond-flour Irish soda bread, too, but probably tomorrow. I'm stretching out my Irish foods this week. Who says Paddy's Day has to be celebrated only on a single day?

    I met with my ayurvedic practitioner yesterday, and it was very helpful. She put my weight loss into important context for me. It simply hadn't dawned on me that losing nearly 40 pounds of fat has created some major shifts for my body--beyond a smaller form with a need for different size clothes. DUH. I won't go into too many details about ayurveda, but basically, the removal of significant fat has removed a buffer that has both physical and energetic effects. And now there are some habits and practices I can adjust to help address some of the effects that are less desirable.

    One of which is my menstrual cycle. My last one was very odd, and time will tell how much that shift was caused by HCG, the fat loss, and/or the fact that I'm very likely beginning to enter perimenopause. But in the meantime, I would do best to cut back on coffee, especially in the two weeks leading up to my period, as well as take some other measures to deliberately pacify some of the heat in my body--through food choices, aromatherapy, activity, sleep, etc. Oh, and I love this one best: she prescribed a little raw chocolate to be eaten every day of the second half of my cycle. I'm SO down with that!

    So we'll see how that affects things for the next two cycles before deciding if any other interventions are needed. I like this gentle approach. But cutting back or cutting out coffee may take a little doing. It's become such a central part of how I live, manage hunger, and maintain a decent fasting window. Decaf isn't much help, because it's the coffee itself that is so acidic and heating, with or without caffeine. One cup, maybe one and half, is OK. She likes the idea of softening the coffee with spices and milk and sweetener of some variety, but any and all of that breaks the fast for me as I've found it most useful.

    Anyway, it's something to experiment and play with. I love chai tea, and she likes that for me very much, but a daily habit of it destroys my teeth with staining. I have found some other beverages I really love, like RASA, and I just ordered some cacao to be brewed like coffee. Maybe eventually I'll switch to those. But I sure do love my coffee. So for now I'm just going to cut back to one perfect cup in the morning. And drink more water. No doubt that will be a very good thing for this body.

    I was awake way too early this morning, so I'll likely need a nap. But I think a yoga practice will serve me well, followed by a walk when the sun rises. Teaching barre later this morning, and i have a chiropractic appointment in the afternoon. It's supposed to be sunny and warm today, so I may go for a hike after the chiropractor--and squeeze in finishing grading between those luscious things, as well as enjoy the heck out of my corned beef and cabbage!

  8. #128
    Super Member! Dubbles's Avatar
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    Happy St. Paddy's Day Miss M. Enjoy your Irish food celebration! Thank you for your response to mrsstrong, and thanks too for sharing your experience with your ayurvedic practitioner. Losing almost 40 lb is freakin HUGE! I'm sure it has created shifts in your body compostition. Wonder are you cold a lot? Lost that layer of fat we gain with 40 extra lbs. Sorry to hear about your coffee, I thought I would try and not go back to coffee with cream after P2, but it is the first thing I did. And it is very comforting and enjoyable on cool mornings. Don't like decaf personally. You are a very busy girl, and sounds like you have some exciting trips planned this year. Hope you'll be able to do those this year!

  9. #129
    Quote Originally Posted by DivineMissM View Post
    Thanks for your candor, mrsstrong. Definitely food for thought about long-term maintenance and who we want to be with and around food. It's simply going to be a lifelong process, I'm afraid. At least for me. I fully aware that my relationship and behavior with food is the source of major lessons for me in this life, and it helps me to see it in that kind of spiritual way.

    But what you said gives me pause, because of course, like you, I would like to think I'll be done with HCG after I fully stabilize at goal. However, it's entirely possible I'll need and want to return for a round from time to time. But what can I do now to help pre-correct that potential course is kind of what I'm thinking--while also remain compassionate toward myself if and when I do need to come back?

    I sincerely hope you're not beating yourself up about the change in direction of your intended course. Life certainly does happen. And all of us often make choices we know aren't in our best interest, ie giving in to the carb monster when we know keto-style works best. For me it's a matter of dieting fatigue, frankly, and so I'm thinking about how to address that ahead of time. Allowing for enough "treats" and freedom with food so I don't feel like I'm living with a dieting mentality and yet also having some mechanisms in place so those treats don't become a runaway train feels like a key. In other words, how to allow for true once-in-a-while treats without feeding that carb monster so fully that it's out of control?

    I think for me I know what foods are least healthy for me. Some of them I can pretty much stay away from indefinitely without much bother, like seed oils and processed, packaged foods I simply don't care for. However, the time will come when I will deliberately want to eat some of the things I know aren't as healthy for me. I'm thinking about dairy and sugar and wheat, for example. Yes, I will want to eat ice cream this summer, probably in a cone. But I will have one really amazingly worth-it cone from some small-batch, locally-made, artisanal ice cream shop, probably while on vacation--or at least a daycation drive to the lakeshore. I won't buy a gallon (or even a pint) from the grocery store and keep it in my freezer. That's a food without brakes for me, and having it around will definitely feed the sugar dragon, as I like to call it, and serve as a gateway to all kinds of bad choices, potentially for much longer than I would like.

    One less-than-healthy choice can lead to another and another and another and on and on. I've witnessed it in myself so many times. I would like to think I've learned that a less-than-healthy choice (and subsequent resulting tangential less-than-healthy choices) need to have an end point. I think that's why I was able to stabilize through the holidays last year following my first round of HCG. I loosened the reins just enough to feel like I fully indulged in all the ways I really wanted to (and believe me: I did INDULGE); however, I had a date to start my second round, so when I still had leftover New Year's black-eyed peas at that point, I stuck them in the freezer and then gave them to BF. He just ate them two weeks ago and loved every bite.

    Anyway, I'm still in P3 and have a little more than another week to go, and I'm already beginning to experiment a bit. My P3 is dairy-free as well as starch- and sugar-free; however, as I mentioned yesterday, I did off road the tiniest bit on Sunday during date night with BF: a sip of beer, dipping a homemade potato chip in blue cheese dressing. And it was fine. It also happened amid a meal of steak with broccoli and green beans. So I also think context matters. If I balance a little "treat" with plenty of protein and non-starchy vegetable, that tends to help stave off the sugar dragon. I'm quite certain it's part being well nourished and having a solid base as well as other more scientific and complex navigation and balancing of hormonal response through food. Though I did notice that on the drive home, I was snacky. It was late and I wasn't physiologically hungry, but I had a desire to nosh on something as I drove. But I made a rule for myself years ago that I don't eat in the car, so it was a NO CHOICE moment. By the time I got home, I had made it through the craving and was perfectly fine. But I can't help but wonder if that was one of those moments--when a less-than-healthy choice potentially opens the floodgates to more less-than-healthy choices. But I headed it off with a mechanism in place to halt that next less-than-healthy choice.

    This is where I think the cognitive behavioral therapy techniques I've learned in Beck Diet Solution come in extremely handy. At some point there needs to be an intellectual override to the body's desires and cravings, and having some very practical tools really helps.

    i've gone on long enough about this, but again, thank you for raising this. It's certainly a major part of my process to consider and reflect on how I want to live long term--and in a way that allows me to maintain and stabilize for as long and effortlessly as possible, becoming aware of weight gains and negative patterns and less-than-healthy choices sooner rather than later so I can correct and change course before the need is so great as to require another round of HCG. Though if it happens, it happens. It's all learning, I like to say. . . .
    All of this, MissM. Thank you for writing it out. Sounds like me to a T. My temptation is that I don't live alone and make delicious food for my family. When they order burgers and fries the whole house smells. They are not allowed to use my car to get it because then the car smells too! I love fries. Thank God, I can stay away from cookies and gluten. Sweet potatoes, corn chips, ice cream, chocolate, plantain, not so much. Allowing even keto treats is a bad idea. It still does something to me.

    Then at times I just get upset I can't eat like everyone else and Covid is making other things I could do harder when I feel sorry for myself. The gym is open again though so that helps me. Regarding the gym, it is the same thing but in reverse: I only go if I can go consistently (enough). The opening and closing did a number on me and I never could get in the remote workouts they offered. It took me a while after they opened again last month to figure out a schedule since the hours were different. Back at it!

    I am not beating myself up though, that much I have learned and if there ends up being a cycle of time that I give in and can't stop and go back to HCG maybe so be it. I just don't want it to be every year.

    Funny you mention not eating in the car. It is where I left the bag of chocolate-covered plantain chips so I would not be tempted. It worked in the beginning. When I remembered they were in the car, it was like a present. I'd have a few, and put it back on the back seat. One day, I was hungry and figured it would just be my carb allowance for the day, which was already higher than it had been before the round, and I had more than a serving. Then I bought another bag and that one was inhaled. There was something freeing in eating what I wanted, especially knowing I was headed to another round of HCG. So that seems to be my pattern. At some point, it seems easier to let go knowing I could do the round than to fight the urges.

    Your occasional ice cream cone and fried plantain sound like a good plan and planning treats may help me. If I had treated these past three months that way, I can think back and see I would have had 4 occasions for a treat: My daughter's birthday, mine around Valentine's day, and my coast vacation. Maybe I could plan a day a month or so where I can just have what I want. I just need a strong plan for the next day to get off the carb without jeopardizing my metabolism. Maybe a planned high protein and fat day without it being a correction/steak day per se. I lost while loading so it may be good for me.
    I never cheat when on HCG so I think planning helps me. Simplicity helps me. Planning treats may help too so I don't feel trapped in dieting. It is an intellectual override for sure. So well put. Thanks for the therapy!
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  10. #130
    Super Member! Dubbles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrsstrong View Post
    All of this, MissM. Thank you for writing it out. Sounds like me to a T. My temptation is that I don't live alone and make delicious food for my family. When they order burgers and fries the whole house smells. They are not allowed to use my car to get it because then the car smells too! I love fries. Thank God, I can stay away from cookies and gluten. Sweet potatoes, corn chips, ice cream, chocolate, plantain, not so much. Allowing even keto treats is a bad idea. It still does something to me.

    Then at times I just get upset I can't eat like everyone else and Covid is making other things I could do harder when I feel sorry for myself. The gym is open again though so that helps me. Regarding the gym, it is the same thing but in reverse: I only go if I can go consistently (enough). The opening and closing did a number on me and I never could get in the remote workouts they offered. It took me a while after they opened again last month to figure out a schedule since the hours were different. Back at it!

    I am not beating myself up though, that much I have learned and if there ends up being a cycle of time that I give in and can't stop and go back to HCG maybe so be it. I just don't want it to be every year.

    Funny you mention not eating in the car. It is where I left the bag of chocolate-covered plantain chips so I would not be tempted. It worked in the beginning. When I remembered they were in the car, it was like a present. I'd have a few, and put it back on the back seat. One day, I was hungry and figured it would just be my carb allowance for the day, which was already higher than it had been before the round, and I had more than a serving. Then I bought another bag and that one was inhaled. There was something freeing in eating what I wanted, especially knowing I was headed to another round of HCG. So that seems to be my pattern. At some point, it seems easier to let go knowing I could do the round than to fight the urges.

    Your occasional ice cream cone and fried plantain sound like a good plan and planning treats may help me. If I had treated these past three months that way, I can think back and see I would have had 4 occasions for a treat: My daughter's birthday, mine around Valentine's day, and my coast vacation. Maybe I could plan a day a month or so where I can just have what I want. I just need a strong plan for the next day to get off the carb without jeopardizing my metabolism. Maybe a planned high protein and fat day without it being a correction/steak day per se. I lost while loading so it may be good for me.
    I never cheat when on HCG so I think planning helps me. Simplicity helps me. Planning treats may help too so I don't feel trapped in dieting. It is an intellectual override for sure. So well put. Thanks for the therapy!
    I hear you mrsstrong, aren't Miss M's postings wonderful. Sometimes she seems to write what's in my head, and I think WHAT, HOW DO YOU DO THAT? That's why the forums are helpful, I think, some people can just articulate things better than others, better than me anyway.

    Now your post really is making me think. We have all been talking about mindful eating, and I can see having a planned day, or meal for a treat might be helpful, and if planned, definitely mindful. And I thought the sentence "I just need a strong plan for the next day to get off the carb without jeopardizing my metabolism. Maybe a planned high protein and fat day without it being a correction/steak day per se" so interesting and may be for me a viable stratergy for future.

    Which begs the question, Leez, or anyone--on P3 is it okay to just do a high protein/fat day at any time? Or would that sabotage stablization. I am exactly 1 lb over last dose weight, no need for correction. But today so far I have had only sausage patties, and grilled chicken nuggets--if I wanted to continue and have only protein and fats for the day would that be a bad idea? Any feedback from anyone. I've never done just a protein day during p3, except for correction days in the past, which were really Full Fat Fage days. Thanks.

  11. #131
    Chief Moderator (my happy place :) Leez's Avatar
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    Which begs the question, Leez, or anyone--on P3 is it okay to just do a high protein/fat day at any time? Or would that sabotage stablization.
    Yes, as long as you don't restrict calories and satisfy hunger. In fact, Linda Prinster has what she calls a high protein day to ward of a looming steak day. Its not completely carb free, as she suggests lettuce or celery with tuna salad (whole can) for lunch and a big portion of protein with a small salad for dinner, but extremely low carb. So you could do your favorite adaptation of that. If you do Linda's high protein day, she suggests 2 eggs for breakfast if you are extra hungry.

    This type of eating day will generally bring most people down about a pound.

    Personally, they didn't work well for me, but I'm a person that doesn't feel or do well on low carb regimens. So after a while I decided that it was better to just wait and do steak days if needed. It may work for you. You can give it a try and see.
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  12. #132
    Super Member! Dubbles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leez View Post
    Yes, as long as you don't restrict calories and satisfy hunger. In fact, Linda Prinster has what she calls a high protein day to ward of a looming steak day. Its not completely carb free, as she suggests lettuce or celery with tuna salad (whole can) for lunch and a big portion of protein with a small salad for dinner, but extremely low carb. So you could do your favorite adaptation of that. If you do Linda's high protein day, she suggests 2 eggs for breakfast if you are extra hungry.

    This type of eating day will generally bring most people down about a pound.

    Personally, they didn't work well for me, but I'm a person that doesn't feel or do well on low carb regimens. So after a while I decided that it was better to just wait and do steak days if needed. It may work for you. You can give it a try and see.

    Thanks Leez, I think I will give it a try, or modified try. Will check in tomorrow with results. Today at weigh in was exactly one lb over last dose weight. I really like that 2 lb window of wiggle room.

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