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Thread: The Plan for P4 - quest for stabilizaton continues

  1. #301
    Chief Moderator (my happy place :) Leez's Avatar
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    Colleen says it takes several months to build up to a sensitivity from repetition. So apparently, thats not a real issue for a long time.

    I'm going to keep doing friendly days until I have a significant drop that takes me closer to LIW. So I think a pound or two. I have to take it day by day, because it seems I can't predict tomorrow at this point.
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  2. #302
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    I've been researching rotation and elimination diets, Leez, since that is what Lyn Genet describes her Plan to be. The most common rotation is a 4 day rotation as that allows sufficient time for bowel exit in most people. The idea is that the food is not eaten again for 4 days. There are 3 purposes. The first two, as you and Grammy have noted, probably have no relevance to your complications. The first goal of a rotation is to prevent new food sensitivities. The second goal is to manage food current sensitivities, and I think Lyn Genet alludes to this in her book when she says that it is possible to eat a food we are sensitive to, as long as there is sufficient time between exposures.

    But the third goal of a rotation diet definitely could be at play here. It helps to identify foods we are senstive to which are masked. An unmasked reaction is when you have a reaction soon after eating the food and so you readily take note of the connection. But a masked reaction can be delayed for several hours, and many sources indicate that more than 24 hrs later is not common. I even saw some comments about delayed reactions on the Plan FB group. Once source I found says that when we repeatedly eat a food that gives us a masked reaction, we get chronic symptoms which do not necessarily occur or worsen when we eat them. Instead, we might feel stimulated by the food or crave it or experience discomfort if we don't eat it for a few days.

    So this makes me wonder whether the rotation of every 4 days is good practice until we really know what our safe foods are. I mean, after all, the baseline diet of safe foods is just a guess based on clinical trials. What if pumpkin seeds were causing a problem, and the person didn't know it because they were already eating pumpkin seeds before starting? (I know that isn't you...just trying to give an example). So then, if they continued to eat pumpkin seeds, they might struggle right from the get go with The Plan, getting all kinds of conflicting data.

    Anyway, I haven't studied her diet closely enough to see if she even uses the 4 day rotation, but that could be a factor maybe? I think rotation is just another layer of protection to ensure that allergens are detected.
    ROUND ONE (7/4/15)
    Start 176.5lbs (+5.7lbs load)
    LIW 153.1lbs

    ROUND TWO (9/30/15)
    Start 157.9lbs (+6lb load)
    LIW 146.2
    Now in P4


  3. #303
    Chief Moderator (my happy place :) Leez's Avatar
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    She does say somewhere to rotate the food or lose it. But its unclear to me whether that means from day to day, or even from meal to meal. I think she also says somewhere that you need at least 3 dinner proteins to have enough rotation...so that seems to corroborate what you found about a 4 day rotation. But all that is discussed for when you have completed the 20 days.

    She also denies the concept of a delayed reaction that doesn't show up until the second day. If she is wrong about that, then I think that this plan is no more definitive than P3 testing. However, she does say that a reaction can continue on for more than one day.

    I think you'll probably have to do what I did, and isolate the seeds to their own test days. For me, I had been able to have sunflower seeds, so I just started off with the flax and sunflower, and then tested pumpkin. You may have to isolate even further and do day 1 over a couple times until you figure it out.

    Hemp seeds/hearts are another option to test if you fail one of the seeds. They make the yummiest nutmilk ever.
    At goal since 2015. \(ᵔᴥᵔ)/ Total HCG loss: 77# [5'5" 210-133] Maintenance strategies overview

    A full review of my experience with DietDoc and how the round progressed can be found here: my Diet Doc review and my Hcg coaching blog is here. If you've found my posts helpful, please consider using this DietDoc link on your next HCG order. (your forum discount still applies)

    Medical Disclaimer: My statements are not intended to treat, diagnose or cure any medical condition.

  4. #304
    Chief Moderator (my happy place :) Leez's Avatar
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    Finally down again after friendly day8 again.

    Loss: .6

    Used the friendly day to recheck pomegranate, so that's confirmed as fine. I kind of feel like I have to re-confirm things I pass since I had so much trouble with that in the cleanse foods. I'm still gob-smacked everytime I lose after a day with almonds or almond butter. Its so nice to be able to have almonds again.

    I think I will do at least one more go at Day 8 before I move on to the next test. I think for tonight as a mini-test, I will mix some regular romaine into my spring greens so I can be sure that's an OK addition in to my salads. It keeps so much longer than the baby greens.
    At goal since 2015. \(ᵔᴥᵔ)/ Total HCG loss: 77# [5'5" 210-133] Maintenance strategies overview

    A full review of my experience with DietDoc and how the round progressed can be found here: my Diet Doc review and my Hcg coaching blog is here. If you've found my posts helpful, please consider using this DietDoc link on your next HCG order. (your forum discount still applies)

    Medical Disclaimer: My statements are not intended to treat, diagnose or cure any medical condition.

  5. #305
    Super Chief-Ninja Moderator grammy1952's Avatar
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    Awesome!!
    My expert Hcg Diet advice is based specifically on the original Simeons Protocol and over 10 years experience as a weight loss and nutrition coach. Grammy's personal protocol:Grammy's Hcg Diet Protocol
    Grammy's author website: ColleenCoble.com

    I am not a medical doctor and my statements are not intended to treat, diagnose or cure any medical condition. Please always check with your doctor for medical questions and assistance. Medical Disclaimer:

  6. #306
    Chief Moderator (my happy place :) Leez's Avatar
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    One of the things that makes me glad I can eat pomegranate (beside that its a super yummy treat) is that it is anti-inflammatory. Its a win-win.
    At goal since 2015. \(ᵔᴥᵔ)/ Total HCG loss: 77# [5'5" 210-133] Maintenance strategies overview

    A full review of my experience with DietDoc and how the round progressed can be found here: my Diet Doc review and my Hcg coaching blog is here. If you've found my posts helpful, please consider using this DietDoc link on your next HCG order. (your forum discount still applies)

    Medical Disclaimer: My statements are not intended to treat, diagnose or cure any medical condition.

  7. #307
    Super Chief-Ninja Moderator grammy1952's Avatar
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    For sure! I've never eaten a pomegranate. LOL They aren't common around here at all. I like the flavor of it in drinks and stuff but have never actually tasted the fruit.
    My expert Hcg Diet advice is based specifically on the original Simeons Protocol and over 10 years experience as a weight loss and nutrition coach. Grammy's personal protocol:Grammy's Hcg Diet Protocol
    Grammy's author website: ColleenCoble.com

    I am not a medical doctor and my statements are not intended to treat, diagnose or cure any medical condition. Please always check with your doctor for medical questions and assistance. Medical Disclaimer:

  8. #308
    Chief Moderator (my happy place :) Leez's Avatar
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    Growing up, it was always a special treat my dad would bring for us in the fall every year. Costco carries gi-normous beauties when they are in season, so I always look forward to that. Sometimes the little puny ones you get in regular groceries aren't very good.
    At goal since 2015. \(ᵔᴥᵔ)/ Total HCG loss: 77# [5'5" 210-133] Maintenance strategies overview

    A full review of my experience with DietDoc and how the round progressed can be found here: my Diet Doc review and my Hcg coaching blog is here. If you've found my posts helpful, please consider using this DietDoc link on your next HCG order. (your forum discount still applies)

    Medical Disclaimer: My statements are not intended to treat, diagnose or cure any medical condition.

  9. #309
    Chief Moderator (my happy place :) Leez's Avatar
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    Gain: .4

    Water was good, BBT is nice and high. So, either I'm reactive to romaine lettuce, or I messed something else up. I think I repeated the day closely with the exception of adding a cup or so of chopped romaine to my salad greens.

    As I thought about it, it seems the only other difference from yesterday's food list was that I had some grated manchego cheese in my dinner salad, that I forgot to add the day before. Looking back on all the menus that had chicken and cheese in the dinner menu (including the protein test ones) since my break, I've had a gain or stall on all of them. Before the break, I did show a small loss after one of those days, but also a big one. It was before I started keeping detailed food logs, though, so I might have forgotten to add the cheese on that big loss day.

    So I think what I will do today is do Day 3 (which has no cheese at all), and then try Day8 again with the romaine, but without the dinner cheese and see if that is indeed what is going on.

    If that is the issue, then maybe my failed protein tests didn't really fail on the protein. If so, then I guess I have to decide if its the actual cheese variety, or if it is because it was in the same meal as the protein.
    At goal since 2015. \(ᵔᴥᵔ)/ Total HCG loss: 77# [5'5" 210-133] Maintenance strategies overview

    A full review of my experience with DietDoc and how the round progressed can be found here: my Diet Doc review and my Hcg coaching blog is here. If you've found my posts helpful, please consider using this DietDoc link on your next HCG order. (your forum discount still applies)

    Medical Disclaimer: My statements are not intended to treat, diagnose or cure any medical condition.

  10. #310
    Super Chief-Ninja Moderator grammy1952's Avatar
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    Glad you are tracking everything on paper!
    My expert Hcg Diet advice is based specifically on the original Simeons Protocol and over 10 years experience as a weight loss and nutrition coach. Grammy's personal protocol:Grammy's Hcg Diet Protocol
    Grammy's author website: ColleenCoble.com

    I am not a medical doctor and my statements are not intended to treat, diagnose or cure any medical condition. Please always check with your doctor for medical questions and assistance. Medical Disclaimer:

  11. #311
    Chief Moderator (my happy place :) Leez's Avatar
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    I've come to the conclusion that you have to track your food list closely. There are just too many variables. Its turning out not to be as simple as "add a new food and see if you pass".

    Also, for those following along, I found some youtubes of a webinar Lyn-Genet gave at Hawthorne University last fall. I really got a lot of out listening to them. It helped me understand the testing process more clearly. Each is about 90 min, but well worth the time. Probably more like 60 min actually presentation, the rest is questions and promos.

    The Plan: Understanding Your Chemical Response to Food – Part I
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TR7Q-TwABaY

    The Plan - Part II: Tracking and Understanding Your Body’s Data
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FtBMJI84Sxk
    At goal since 2015. \(ᵔᴥᵔ)/ Total HCG loss: 77# [5'5" 210-133] Maintenance strategies overview

    A full review of my experience with DietDoc and how the round progressed can be found here: my Diet Doc review and my Hcg coaching blog is here. If you've found my posts helpful, please consider using this DietDoc link on your next HCG order. (your forum discount still applies)

    Medical Disclaimer: My statements are not intended to treat, diagnose or cure any medical condition.

  12. #312
    Super Chief-Ninja Moderator grammy1952's Avatar
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    I wish they had that with a transcript. I never have time to listen to stuff like that.
    My expert Hcg Diet advice is based specifically on the original Simeons Protocol and over 10 years experience as a weight loss and nutrition coach. Grammy's personal protocol:Grammy's Hcg Diet Protocol
    Grammy's author website: ColleenCoble.com

    I am not a medical doctor and my statements are not intended to treat, diagnose or cure any medical condition. Please always check with your doctor for medical questions and assistance. Medical Disclaimer:

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