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View Poll Results: Does Dr. Woliner's argument hold water?

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  • Yes, Dr. Woliner references the statements he makes.

    2 2.04%
  • Yes, the argument sounds good, but I haven't checked out his references to know for sure.

    3 3.06%
  • Yes, but I still disagree with him. I lost weight with hCG and it worked for me!

    58 59.18%
  • No. Dr. Woliner is full of it. He made all this stuff up.

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Thread: Dr. Woliner's views on hCG and weight loss

  1. #1

    Dr. Woliner's views on hCG and weight loss

    A forum administrator named "Jarret" asked me to start this thread. I'll post more details later on, but for now, I'll copy and paste an article I wrote on the hCG diet. It was originally posted here: http://www.holisticfamilymed.com/res...hcg-diet-hoax/

    The Hidden Dangers of The hCG Diet
    By Kenneth N. Woliner, M.D.
    Posted: Monday, April 18th, 2011


    My office gets calls each week, “Do you do the hCG Diet?”

    This astounds me. hCG injections as an easy way to lose weight? Think again. It’s a scam, a fraud, a hoax, a deception.

    I originally learned about the hCG diet when I studied as a Nutrition major at Cornell University. Human chorionic gonadotropin (hCG) is a hormone produced by the placenta during pregnancy. It’s the very same hormone, in fact, that turns the stick blue on a home pregnancy test. Dr. Albert T.W. Simeons first described the use of hCG as a treatment for obesity in a case series published in 1954 [1]. The Simeons Method consisted of a rigid diet of only 500 calories per day for forty days, along with the abstinence from using any medications or skin care products, and daily deep intramuscular injections of 125 units of hCG. The treatment became popularly known in 1957, when Harper’s Bazaar printed the story, “Slimming: A Roman Doctor’s Treatment” where Dr. Simeons claimed hCG would redistribute fat from the waist, hips and thighs, and his patients weren’t hungry as long as they took shots of hCG [2].
    When diet clinics (run by other physicians, not Dr. Simeons) started popping up in the 1970’s offering “The Simeons Method” and “The hCG Diet”, people lost weight, but they lost their hair too [3]. When patients realized how unhealthy the diet was, they resumed eating. Their weight came back, but for at least a few unfortunate souls, their hair did not [4, 5].

    Starvation itself leads to a reduced appetite [6]. The 500-calorie (semi-starvation) diet caused loss of protein from vital organs. When other physicians tried to replicate Dr. Simeons’ results in double-blind studies, they realized that the shots didn’t do anything, and that weight loss was due to the diet alone [7]. Study after study was published showing that the injections were just expensive placebos [8-13].

    In 1976, the FTC ordered the diet clinics to stop their false and misleading advertising [14]. Though they couldn’t stop doctors from using hCG (the FDA allows hCG to be used for infertility treatments), it did make them disclose to every patient the following:

    THESE WEIGHT REDUCTION TREATMENTS INCLUDE THE INJECTION OF HCG, A DRUG WHICH HAS NOT BEEN APPROVED BY THE FOOD AND DRUG ADMINISTRATION AS SAFE AND EFFECTIVE IN THE TREATMENT OF OBSITY OR WEIGHT CONTROL. THERE IS NO SUBSTANTIAL EVIDENCE THAT HCG INCEASES WEIGHT LOSS BEYOND THAT RESULTING FROM CALORIC RESTRICTION, THAT IT CAUSES A MORE ATTRACTIVE OR “NORMAL” DISTRIBUTION OF FAT, OR THAT IT DECREASES THE HUNGER AND DISCOMFORT ASSOCIATED WITH CALORIE-RESTRICTIVE DIETS.

    Negative studies and government action reduced the use of hCG injections for weight control close to zero [15]. Why the recent resurgence in clinics advertising hCG shots and sublingual drops? Thank Kevin Trudeau and his 2007 book, The Weight Loss Cure They Don’t Want You to Know About [16].

    Kevin Trudeau is a two-time convicted felon (impersonating a doctor and forging checks, and identity theft by stealing names and Social Security numbers, applying for credit cards and running up huge charges) who also happens to be one heck of a salesman [17]. His favorite marketing tool is the “infomercial,” a lengthy television advertisement that takes the form of a mock interview [18]. Through this medium Mr. Trudeau has sold various worthless products that he claimed could: cure numerous diseases, such as multiple sclerosis, cancer, substance abuse addictions, and arthritis (among many others); “hair farming” (a cure for balding); improve memory; and cause dramatic and permanent weight loss [19]. In 2004, the FTC won a permanent injunction prohibiting Mr. Trudeau from producing or disseminating infomercials with one narrow exception, for First Amendment reasons, he was still allowed to talk about his books [20].

    Misleading commercial speech is entitled to no First Amendment protection however, so in 2007, the FTC charged Kevin Trudeau with violating a court order by misrepresenting the contents of the book [21]. In infomercials, Trudeau falsely claimed that the book’s weight-loss plan is easy to do, can be done at home, and ultimately allows readers to eat whatever they want. The hCG diet as described in his book, however, states that for the rest of your life, you can never use a microwave, never consume any chain restaurant food, avoid all artificial sweeteners, eat 100% organic food, exercise outside at least one hour a day, and among other things, periodically do colonic irrigation. In 2008, the Court ruled that his book was merely an advertisement for his website and newsletter, at a cost of $71 per month, that Trudeau had violated the previous order for making false claims, and ordered Trudeau to pay $37.6 million, the amount paid by consumers he defrauded [22].

    The hCG diet is now being advertised everywhere as it is very lucrative for the physician and pharmacy to sell you worthless medication (that is often misbranded knockoffs from China and India) [23]. It still doesn’t work, but I guess the MIT study was right, expensive placebos are more convincing that cheap placebos [24]. The American Society of Bariatric Physicians (ASBP) has put forth a position statement that the hCG diet doesn’t work, is potentially dangerous, and isn’t recommended [25]. You might consider people that try the hCG diet to just be desperate to lose weight, but the state attorney would more likely classify them as victims of unscrupulous clinicians.

    No one likes to be played for a fool. Dr. G. Michael Steelman, editor of the American Journal of Bariatric Medicine stated at the ASBP annual conference in November 2010, “This is going to explode, just like phen/fen [26].” I have to agree.

    The State of Louisiana has already banned the use of hCG in the treatment of obesity [27]. I predict that in 2011, the FTC will come down on everyone and anyone advertising the hCG diet for violations of the Federal Trade Commission Act [28]. The FDA will send warning letters telling clinics and pharmacies that if they do not cease and desist from unsubstantiated claims, they will be subject to raids from the DEA for violating the Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act [29]. And the Florida medical board will reprimand any clinician offering hCG weight loss treatments for making deceptive, untrue, or fraudulent representations in or related to the practice of a profession or employing a trick or scheme in or related to the practice of a profession [30].

    In the meantime, what does my receptionist say when prospective patients ask whether we offer the hCG diet? “We’ve looked at it, we’ve studied it, we’ve compared the data, and we get better results without the added cost of hCG.”


    REFERENCES:

    [1] Simeons AT. The action of chorionic gonadotrophin in the obese. Lancet. 1954
    Nov 6;267(6845):946-7.
    [2] Fraser L. Ten Pounds in Ten Days – A Sampler of Diet Fads and Abuse. In Fraser L. Losing It: False Hopes and Fat Profits in the Diet Industry. New York, NY: Plume; 1998.
    [3] Blackburn GL, Bistrian BR, Hoag C. Letter: Hair loss with rapid weight loss. JAMA. 1976 Jul 19;236(3):252.
    [4] Dulloo AG, Jacquet J, Girardier L. Poststarvation hyperphagia and body fat overshooting in humans: a role for feedback signals from lean and fat tissues. Am J Clin Nutr. 1997 Mar;65(3):717-23.
    [5] Goette DK, Odom RB. Alopecia in crash dieters. JAMA. 1976 Jun 14;235(24):2622-3.
    [6] Andik I, Donhoffer S, Moring I, Szentes J. The effect of starvation on food intake and selection. Acta Physiol Hung. 1951;2(3-4):363-8.
    [7] Sohar E. A forty-day-550 calorie diet in the treatment of obese outpatients. Am J Clin Nutr. 1959 Sep-Oct;7:514-8.
    [8] Frank BW. The use of chorionic gonadotrophin hormone in the treatment of obesity. A double-blind study. American Journal of Clinical Nutrition 1964;14:133–136.
    [9] Stein M, Julis R, Peck C, Hinshaw W, Sawicki J, Deller J, Jr. Ineffectiveness of human chorionic gonadotropin in weight reduction: a double-blind study. Am J Clin Nutr 1976; 29:940-948.
    [10] Young RL, Fuchs RJ, Woltjen MJ. Chorionic Gonadotropin in Weight Control: A Double-Blind Crossover Study. JAMA 1976; 236:2495-2497.
    [11] Greenway FL, Bray GA. Human chorionic gonadotropin (HCG) in the treatment of obesity: a critical assessment of the Simeons method. West J Med 1977;127:461-463.
    [12] Bosch B, Venter I, Stewart RI, Bertram SR. Human chorionic gonadotrophin and weight loss. A double-blind, placebo-controlled trial. S Afr Med J 1990;77:185-189.
    [13] Lijesen GK, Theeuwen I, Assendelft WJ, Van Der Wal G. The effect of human chorionic gonadotropin (HCG) in the treatment of obesity by means of the Simeons therapy: a criteria based meta-analysis. Br J Clin Pharmacol. 1995;40:237-243.
    [14] Federal Trade Commission Decisions. Complaint in the matter of Simeon Management Corporation et al. Order, opinion etc., in regard to alleged violation of Secs. 5 and 12 of the Federal Trade Commission Act. Docket 8996. Complaint, Oct 15, 1974. Final Order April 29, 1976.
    [15] Barrett, Stephen. HCG Worthless as Weight-Loss Aid. http://www.dietscam.org/reports/hcg.shtml Accessed November 21, 2010.
    [16] Trudeau K. The Weight Loss Cure They Don’t Want You to Know About. Birmingham, AL: Alliance Publishing; 2007.
    [17] Warner, M. After Jail and More, Salesman Scores Big With Cure-All Book. NY Times. August 28, 2005.
    [18] Wikipedia – “Kevin Trudeau”. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_Trudeau accessed November 21, 2010. [19] Barrett, S. Kevin Trudeau Found In Contempt of Court Again. http://www.casewatch.org/ftc/enforce...contempt.shtml accessed November 21, 2010.
    [20] Kevin Trudeau Banned from Infomercials For Three Years, Ordered to Pay More Than $5 Million for False Claims About Weight-Loss Book. October 6, 2008. http://www.ftc.gov/opa/2008/10/trudeau.shtm accessed November 21, 2010.
    [21] Central Hudson Gas & Elec. Corp. v. Pub. Serv. Comm’n, 447 U.S. 557, 562-63 (1980).
    [22] Judge Orders Kevin Trudeau to Pay More Than $37 Million for False Claims About Weight-Loss Book. http://www.ftc.gov/opa/2009/01/trudeau.shtm accessed November 21, 2010.
    [23] Barrett, S. Illegal HCG Seized at Naturopathic Clinic. http://www.casewatch.org/doj/marscha...lication.shtml accessed November 21, 2010.
    [24] Waber RL, Shiv B, Ariely D. Commercial Features of Placebo and Therapeutic Efficacy. JAMA. 2008;299(9):1016-1017.
    [25] American College of Bariatric Physicians. Position statement: Use of HCG in the treatment of obesity. Approved Dec 2009.
    [26] Steelman GM. hCG: A Debate. American Society of Bariatric Physicians. 60th Annual Obesity & Associated Conditions Symposium. New Orleans, LA. November 10-14th, 2010.
    [27] Louisiana Statutes. Chapter 69. Prescription, Dispensation, and Administration of Medications. Subchapter A. Medications Used in the Treatment of Obesity. §§6901-6913.
    [28] Federal Trade Commission Act 15 U.S.C §§ 41-58.
    [29] Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act 21 U.S.C. § 301 et seq.
    [30] Florida Statutes 456.072 (a)(m)(n)(gg); 457.109 (d)(k)(n); 458.331 (d)(k)(n)(o)(q)(u)(ee)(qq); 459.015 (d)(r)(t)(y)(ii)(ss); 460.413 (d)(k)(n)(p)(s); 468.518 (g)(h)(m)(n); 465.016 and 465.024.

  2. #2
    Senior Member Laceyinsd's Avatar
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    I don't know but the proof is in the pudding for me! I am so happy right now I could burst. In Aug 2010 I weighed 180 went on hcg got down to 160, maintained that for 6 months , did another round down to 144, maintained that for a year pretty well (gained some over the holidays) just finished my 3 round 131lbs!

    I get my hcg from a NP...I actually knew her growing up. She was always one of the smartest people I knew...she has a degree in Biology from UCSD , full ride. Then she went to be an NP instead of med school , for reasons I'm sure you can all understand...traditional health care is pretty f'ed up ...I think most people can agree on that. She gets the HCG from a compond pharmacy her in CA.

    We did all the bodypod testing on me...I gained muscle and lost fat according to the test. I did lose some muscle after my first round , but the second and 3rd round I gained. I did not exercise during my p2's. I like yoga in p3/p4...may try crossfit now for fun, as I plan to live a paleo/primal life to maintain . I never lost any hair either...I have thin hair anyway so I would have noticed. I did lose hair after I had a baby right around my hairline.

    One of my other friends is Medical Dr. she is looking into the diet herself after seeing my results. Another friend of mine has a PHD in nutrition and works for big Pharma.. she is a vegan...a fat vegan with bad skin...go figure.

    So Dr., keep pushing those pills and lapbands on your patients instead of offering real results and lifestyle change...good luck with that.

    So freaking happy right now!

  3. #3
    Super Chief-Ninja Moderator grammy1952's Avatar
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    Jarret didn't "ask" you to start this thread. He said if you disagreed with hcg then the proper place to discuss that was in the boxing ring. Just to be clear. I'm not going to debate you. The thousands on here know it works. shrug.
    My expert Hcg Diet advice is based specifically on the original Simeons Protocol. Grammy's personal protocol:Grammy's Hcg Diet Protocol
    Grammy's author website: ColleenCoble.com

    I am not a medical doctor and my statements are not intended to treat, diagnose or cure any medical condition. Please always check with your doctor for medical questions and assistance. Medical Disclaimer:

  4. #4
    Thousands of Christians knew the sun revolved around the earth too. Hence, Galileo was condemned (not excommunicated) from the Catholic church. http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Why_was_Ga...rom_the_church

  5. #5
    Super Member! Mrs.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grammy1952 View Post
    Jarret didn't "ask" you to start this thread. He said if you disagreed with hcg then the proper place to discuss that was in the boxing ring. Just to be clear. I'm not going to debate you. The thousands on here know it works. shrug.
    I was going to offer to take over the tech admin part of this forum LOLOL I thought something was off.

    Man, I have starved myself before. This ain't it. Pure and simple. Hair falling out on hcg? It probably happens after P2, that is when most women lose hair: after pregnancy. If they lose hair during, something is off with their thyroid. Unfortunately, many allopathic doctors don't even know how to look at those tests properly.

    Round 1 ended 3/25 –30
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    8/17 started high fat/adequate protein/low carb diet (nutritional ketosis):
    Starting weight: 185.4
    11/19 168.6

  6. #6
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    I find the whole purpose of you posting here mystifying. Reality check is, regardless of your research, thousands of people are doing well and maintaining long term, alot of them unable up until now to lose weight at all. It is your profession that trots out the calories in/ calories out, standard food pyramid we all have tried to live by in order to maintain or regain health. It doesn't work. Maybe you and your fellow physicians would be better off debunking the lies we have lived by that has made us fatter and sicker nation/s than ever before. Just a thought.
    R5 - Currently in P3

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Veritas View Post
    It is your profession that trots out the calories in/ calories out, standard food pyramid we all have tried to live by in order to maintain or regain health. It doesn't work. Maybe you and your fellow physicians would be better off debunking the lies we have lived by that has made us fatter and sicker nation/s than ever before. Just a thought.
    Veritas,

    Thank you for your comment It was 1988 when I was a freshman at Cornell, studying Nutrition, when they rolled out the "Food Guide Pyramid" to replace the "Four Food Groups" I was taught in 7th grade health class. My classmates and I said, "Wow! The government is totally bought off by the American Food Industry lobby!". We all said the amount of starch they emphasized would cause the nation to get fatter and develop diabetes (we were right). So, as you see, I agree with you completely on the point you just made.

    I am glad that you, Laceyinsd, and others here on this bulletin board have achieved success with your dieting plan, and done so without excessive (or any) noticeable side effects. I truly wish you all well.

  8. #8
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    Thank you for your well wishes and I am heartened to hear you acknowledge the current state of affairs regarding food recommendations and that the pushing of them by both Nutritionists and Doctors is unhelpful. I wish you no harm and have no issue with differing views, I do think you will meet hostility on this board from many, one of the obvious reasons being the anger around how mislead we have been. I, as many others, have tried so hard for so many years to follow our Doctor's advise, to live according to the rules, only to get fatter and sicker and then feeling it is our fault, that we are doing something wrong, so we keep going back and are told, well eat even less and exercise even more - again it results in nothing but heartache. I only wish the medical profession would find a better way to help their patients and offer some guidelines that actually work. No one wants to be fat or sick, no one wants to work so hard for so long only to find they achieve nothing despite following instructions to a T. It is not surprising that when you finally find something that works, despite opposition by many, you feel grateful and relieved and even blessed.
    R5 - Currently in P3

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by KenWolinerMD View Post
    Thousands of Christians knew the sun revolved around the earth too. Hence, Galileo was condemned (not excommunicated) from the Catholic church. http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Why_was_Ga...rom_the_church

    LOL!...Brilliant "doc", just like the only perfect man (Jesus... just in case you thought I was speaking of you)...was crucified on the cross by GODS own people) heck who gives 2 craps about Galileo really? (yes his discoveries were amazing nontheless)<shrug>. Just curious what was your point of that post? Nevermind, I don't really care either way . Nevertheless, you sure are biding your time well for such a busy "doc", I wish you well and I'm sure with that ego of yours you will say something beyond "smarty" for a rebuttal. Take care and God Bless you.

    P.S. I agree with you about KT, I don't like the man.
    God Bless ~Rose~

    Psalm 71:19~21

    Preload weight 2/26/12~ 146.9
    Postload weight (did load for 3 days instead of 2): 2/26/12~2/28/12~ 148.0
    P1D1~2/29/12: 148.0
    P1D2~3/1/12: 146.0 (-2)
    P1D3~3/2/12: 143.4 (-2.6)
    P1D4~3/3/12: 143.2 (-.2)
    P1D5~3/4/12: 141.6 (-1.6)
    P1D6~3/5/12:
    P1D7~3/6/12:
    TOTAL LOSS FOR WEEK 1:


    Created by MyFitnessPal.com - Free Weight Loss Tools

  10. #10
    Kenneth N. Woliner, M.D.... Sigh... You are trying to convince those of us who, once skeptics of HCG, are now true believers because of our dramatic weight loss in the right places and proportions, with EASE!! We are not ignorant of the ploy of the FDA, food companies, weight loss companies, exercise companies, and pharmas who DESIRE to keep us fat so they can profit wildly. Your attempt to persuade us otherwise is VERY amusing. Sounds like your former fat clients have found HCG and you are no longer making money like you used to?

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by redefiningme View Post
    Kenneth N. Woliner, M.D.... Sigh... You are trying to convince those of us who, once skeptics of HCG, are now true believers because of our dramatic weight loss in the right places and proportions, with EASE!! We are not ignorant of the ploy of the FDA, food companies, weight loss companies, exercise companies, and pharmas who DESIRE to keep us fat so they can profit wildly. Your attempt to persuade us otherwise is VERY amusing. Sounds like your former fat clients have found HCG and you are no longer making money like you used to?
    Amen! Do you think I, or pretty much any of us here, give ANY credence to the FDA??? Everyone is lining their pockets. We just want to lose weight and feel better, which we have done.

  12. #12
    Senior Member PamelaDO's Avatar
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    "No one likes to be played for a fool. Dr. G. Michael Steelman, editor of the American Journal of Bariatric Medicine stated at the ASBP annual conference in November 2010, “This is going to explode, just like phen/fen [26].” I have to agree."

    You mean phen/fen was BAD even though the FDA said it was GOOD? And now they are saying HCG is bad, does that mean it's good?!?!

    Seems like it!





    Week 1 -14.6 Week 2 -3.6
    Week 3: Stopped HCG due to extreme hair loss


    R1: Week 1: -17.2 Week 2: -4.2 Week 3: -4.6 Week 4: -4 Week 5: -3.2 Week 6: -3.2 Total lost R1P2 - 36.4

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